Frank J. Gaffney on The Steve Hook Show – 31 May 2023

Steve Hook, May 15, 2023


Steve Hook: [00:54:38] Well, listen, God bless you, Frank Gaffney. Thank you for everything you do. Thank you for getting the word out. Folks, the book is–and it’s a good one–“The Indictment.” It’s “The Indictment: Prosecuting the Chinese Communist Party and Friends for Crimes against America, China and the World.”



Steve Hook: [00:20:01] Welcome back to The Steve Hook Show. I’m just thrilled to welcome my guest today, Frank Gaffney. Frank is author of the new book I just mentioned, The The Indictment Prosecuting the Chinese Communist Party and Friends for Crimes Against America, China and the World. He is also the founder and executive chair of the Center for Security Policy. That’s a nonprofit that champions peace through strength, very Reaganesque. He’s also the vice chair of the committee on the on the present Danger China and the host of Securing America with Frank Gaffney. He’s I mean, he’s just the accolades. Go on. Without further ado, let’s welcome him to the program. Frank Gaffney. Hello, sir. How are you? It’s so good to have you.

Frank Gaffney: [00:20:41] Steve, it’s great to be with you. It’s a pleasure. Thank you.

Steve Hook: [00:20:44] Welcome to the program, Frank. Boy, I wish this was a five hour program because I’ve got so much to discuss with you. But right out of the gate, let’s talk about your book. I saw you on the steps of the I guess it was the Capitol a couple of weeks ago talking about the [00:21:00] World Health Organization. And this book kind of goes directly to that. It looks to me, and I think anyone that has half a brain looks at this. It looks like this administration is kind of selling our sovereignty right out the back door with the World Health Organization and Tetris. What’s what’s the story here?

Frank Gaffney: [00:21:21] Well, if I could just set the stage a little bit and then jump into that, because that’s really vital to to get to the the backstory is that the Chinese Communist Party or CCP, has been engaged in what they call unrestricted warfare against our country for decades. This entails a large number of lines of attack, none of which is. Violence in character, though I have to say that the biological warfare element was pretty darn violent. It killed over a million of us after all. But [00:22:00] the World Health Organization gambit, the so-called global governance scheme that it is part of, is one of the most insidious of these lines of attack, Steve, because it’s taking place before our very eyes. And yet most of us are unaware it’s happening. It’s being done in this international organization. And the idea is that the fellow who is the director general, a Chinese Communist Party surrogate, someone that they placed in that position for this purpose, I think Tedros Ghebreyesus is his name, would be under a new set of arrangements that are being negotiated as we speak. To have the power to determine what is American and other nations public [00:23:00] health policy with respect to anything that’s called a public health emergency of international concern.

Frank Gaffney: [00:23:08] And it turns out, get this, that it isn’t just human health emergencies that Tedros Ghebreyesus would be able to tell us when we have one and what we have to do about it. It’s also animal health and even plant health emergencies that he would be able to dictate. So you get the whole climate change deal as well as everything from, oh, I don’t know, gun violence to, you know, ah, immigrants without documentation, as they like to say, getting adequate health care as abortion care being sufficiently provided and so on. Transgender, you know, health accommodations, these are the sorts of things that are none of the business, I would argue, of even the federal government of the United [00:24:00] States under our Constitution, let alone some foreign power. But that’s what’s afoot right now. And you’re absolutely right to put your finger on Joe Biden because he is actively supporting and enabling this crushing of American sovereignty and it must not go forward.

Steve Hook: [00:24:19] I you know, it’s chilling just to hear you say that, Frank. And to me, it seems as if and correct me if I’m wrong, I mean, I don’t want to overstate it here, but but it seems to me that that Joe Biden has no real loyalty to country. And I think this is a problem with the Democrat Party. I think it’s party first party second party, always with them. But with Biden, it’s even more insidious. It seems that it seems that it’s what’s in it for the big guy? How much can I make off the back end? And yes, I’ll happily sell my nation’s sovereignty out the back door, provided you give me a little bit of a filthy lucre through the front door. I mean, he seems to be in it for profit and the [00:25:00] media is just ignoring it. No shocker there. Is that kind of what you think, that Biden is just a just a self-serving grifter? Because that’s what it looks like.

Frank Gaffney: [00:25:11] I think at some point you have to say that that’s not the satisfactory or full explanation. You know, you say it’s party first party, second party. Well, I think you could argue that it’s party for Joe Biden, too, only it’s the Chinese Communist Party whose controlled asset, I believe, Joe Biden actually is at this point. So it may be that he thinks he’s furthering the interests of the Democrats. I don’t know. But he certainly thinks that it’s not only going to be good for him, but it is doing what he is told, which is something I think he’s been doing very consistently throughout this presidency. In fact, I think it’s no exaggeration to say, Steve, that every policy this guy has promulgated, whether it’s on the domestic side of the [00:26:00] House or on the international, has two things in common. They’ve all been bad for America and they, I think, have all benefited the Chinese Communist Party.

Steve Hook: [00:26:10] Yeah, it’s hard to argue with that. It’s hard to argue with that. Nobody can. To this to date, nobody can make sense of the wide open southern border. And and, you know, and that goes to your point. Um, do you think do you think, Frank, it’s because they’ve got so much dirt on Joe Biden that they’ve got him kind of they kind of got him in a wringer and saying, you’re going to do this, that and the other, or else we’re going to release this, that and the other in the public square.

Frank Gaffney: [00:26:40] I have no idea. But I will tell you this. One of my colleagues who’s contributed a lot, by the way, to our book, the indictment, is a fellow by the name of Trevor Loudon. I don’t know if you know him or not, but he’s taken the view that Joe Biden, going back to his first run for the United States Senate was essentially, [00:27:00] I guess, a made man, you might say, by the Soviet Communist Party, because they used a front organization called the Council for a Livable World to largely finance his campaign. You know, it’s a small state, so it didn’t take a lot of money and effort. But he nonetheless was from that day forward, enthralled with a pretty radical leftist, in fact, Marxist program. And he got a reputation for being kind of a centrist, moderate Democrat, mostly because of his racism and his affiliation with certain, you know, Ku Klux Klan types like Robert Byrd. But the reality of it is, I think on foreign policy for sure, on relations with adversaries like the Soviet Union and then Russia and China, most especially, there may be an ideological component to this as well, [00:28:00] but maybe it’s just the grifting, I don’t know. But whatever it is, it comes down to the same bottom line. And that is like a lot of other friends and we’re arguing they should be prosecuted in this indictment as well of China elites that have been captured by the Chinese Communist Party. They’re advancing the agenda of the mortal enemy of our country and it is determined to destroy us. They’re aiding and abetting that process. And this is a criminal activity, it seems to me.

Steve Hook: [00:28:34] Yeah. What are some of the biggest bombshells in the book? Obviously, we want people to buy the book. It looks to be a wonderful book. My wife is a my wife is a manager at Barnes and Noble. She called me ten minutes before we went on the air and she goes, I’m holding his book right now. I’m like, Yeah, I figured you might. So So they’ve got it at Barnes and Noble. Of course you can get it at Amazon or wherever you buy your books, I guess. But why don’t you tell us, what are some of the big the big tidbits? Not so much tidbits, but [00:29:00] bombshells in the the indictment prosecuting the Chinese Communist Party and friends. What are some of the things that you found that would shake people up?

Frank Gaffney: [00:29:09] Well, just a word about the structure of it so that people have a sense of what we’re talking about. We’ve got nine counts in this indictment. The first starts with the fact and it’s a bombshell 100 million people have been killed by the Chinese Communist Party. And I think that’s probably conservative. Mostly they’re Chinese, Some, as they say. And that’s not inclusive of an even more staggering number, 400 million. The Chinese boast of murdering in the womb as part of their population control. Why is that so important? Well, it’s not only a calibration point for this unbelievably monstrous regime. Never in the history of humankind has there been anything like it. But it’s also a warning to us. Do you think they will treat us better if [00:30:00] they get their hooks into us, Then they treat their own people? I think not. Yeah, So that’s one bombshell. The other eight the other eight of the indictments deal with their unrestricted warfare against us. Excuse me. Sorry.

Steve Hook: [00:30:13] Sure.

Frank Gaffney: [00:30:14] And so when you look at those Tedros.

Steve Hook: [00:30:16] Tedros is a puppet, though, is what you’re saying?

Frank Gaffney: [00:30:19] No question. He’s a puppet. He was selected by the Chinese Communist Party. They got him the job. He has done their bidding as the director general of the World Health Organization. And again, this is what makes what’s afoot here so frightening is we saw the kind of conduct of that organization under his so-called leadership in what I think of as pandemic 1.0. You know, he told us this thing came out of nature, not a laboratory. He told us that it was not transmissible to humans. He told us that if only we followed what they call the China model of masks and social distancing and lockdowns [00:31:00] and jabs with inadequately tested vaccine, so-called vaccines, and then not least, your vaccine passport, which assures that you’ve complied with all of that. That’s the best way to deal with this. Well, that was done on an advisory basis. And look at the havoc that it inflicted on our people. Steve. And can you imagine how much worse it would be if not only any pandemic, but any thing he conjures up as a public health emergency? He’s able to tell you you’ve got it and he’s able to tell you what to do about it, and you have to do it.

Frank Gaffney: [00:31:35] I can’t think of a more outrageous, you know, abrogation of our constitutional rights and freedoms. And that’s what we’re at the cusp of doing. Just another bombshell that your audience ought to be aware of. The Chinese Communist Party. According to a man who 20 years ago as the then defense minister of China, told [00:32:00] a closed group of party leaders has as its mission. In the form of the biological warfare program, specifically the de-population of the United States, so that it can be colonized by China. And you look at that biological attack, I think that’s just a sort of proof of concept for what they think they can do to us and intend to. So these are the sorts of things that make this unrestricted warfare program of theirs and their multiple facets the economic warfare, the political subversion, the energy warfare, the biological warfare, hollowing out our military, for example, so serious and give rise to the other important part of the book, which is 20 specific actionable steps that we must take if we’re to survive this country in the face of what the Chinese have in mind for us, which I fear includes in the future, a shooting war as well [00:33:00] as the violent kind.

Steve Hook: [00:33:02] We’re speaking with Frank Gaffney. The new book is Indictment. Frank, I tell you, that is all very, very scary. And it’s you know, it wasn’t too long ago that we were hearing people throw around the term plandemic. And of course, they were. They were immediately castigated as tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorists. This is nutty. This is you know, Fauci, of course, got in on it. And now all of a sudden it doesn’t seem so conspiratorial. It seems like it may well, it may be conspiratorial, but it’s not a theory. It may be a practice now. Do you suspect that maybe this virus got out accidentally and then the Chinese just rolled with it? Or what is your suspicion about the origins of Covid and how it plays into this entire thing?

Frank Gaffney: [00:33:50] We did a previous book with a team of very experienced public national security practitioners. The [00:34:00] finding of that book, which is entitled The CCP is at War with America, which is available, by the way, for free at CCP at, is that there’s no evidence that came out of nature, none that’s credible or worth a dang. There is plenty of circumstantial evidence that it came out of the Wuhan Institute of Virology, part of the biological warfare program of the Chinese Communists. And in fact, just today, the I think it’s the chairman of the Chinese Centers for Disease Control actually suggested that something to the effect of, you know, the possibility that this came out of a laboratory can’t be eliminated or precluded. Well, guess what? It came out of that laboratory. And the question of how it came out is still to be determined. We just don’t have enough direct evidence [00:35:00] to say. But what we do know, Steve, is this and it’s it’s again, central to the indictment of the biological warfare charge, and that is that once it was out of the laboratory, through whatever means. The Chinese Communist Party deliberately sent it to the United States and other parts of the world by allowing elderly people from Wuhan, in some cases others, to travel here and elsewhere when they wouldn’t be allowed to travel inside of China. Yeah.

Steve Hook: [00:35:36] Is a biological.

Frank Gaffney: [00:35:37] Attack. It’s a tell.

Steve Hook: [00:35:39] Yeah, that’s that’s that’s that was the huge red flashing light when I said, wait a minute, now if I live in Wuhan and I want to go to Beijing, I’m Sol, I’m out of luck. But if I want to go to London or if I want to go to Prague, or if I want to go to New York, it’s it’s all aboard. I don’t know how we actually were.

Frank Gaffney: [00:35:59] Told [00:36:00] that they may have subsidized people coming, elderly people coming from Wuhan to visit friends and family in the United States. Yeah.

Steve Hook: [00:36:07] To seed it. God almighty that that that is. Now, let me ask you this, Frank. Um, obviously, I saw the, the your little blurb with a whole bunch of other congressmen on the steps of the of the Capitol the other day. How many Republicans are backing this? Hey, we got to back out. We got to get Tedros to hell out. We got to get World Health Organization has no business being in our business. How many of them are are signed up for this and any Democrats amongst them?

Frank Gaffney: [00:36:41] Well, the Democrats I don’t know that we’ve got anybody. I think that Bobby Kennedy Jr. Is aligned with us. But I don’t know that he’s spoken to the point in this context as he’s now presidential candidate for the Democrats. But I’m hoping he will. I believe [00:37:00] there are a number of other Republicans who simply couldn’t make it to the press conference on that particular date and time. But I think we’re well shy of, you know, the majority of the Republicans simply because I think most of them are unaware that this is a problem, that what’s going on and that’s not an accident. This is the thing that is so infuriating about it. Steve, if I may say, Joe Biden and his administration are all in on empowering this global governance, which as a practical matter, is simply a vehicle, another means of achieving what the Chinese Communist Party is attempting to do, which is a new world order, that they run global hegemony for China, not global governance by, you know, some new international elite. And Joe Biden is doing this [00:38:00] basically behind closed doors. He’s doing it in the World Health Organization. Yes. But he’s also doing it at the UN General Assembly. So we have concerns that that what seems now to be in the offing is what they’re trying to do in the public health space to give some unaccountable bureaucrat, Tedros Ghebreyesus, in this case authority to tell us what our public health policy should be. They intend to give the Secretary General of the United Nations similar authority in the non-health global complex crisis space. Come September, when the UN General Assembly meets in New York, that’s another problem. And it’s just of a piece with the unrestricted warfare we believe needs to be prosecuted, not accommodated.

Steve Hook: [00:38:51] Right. We have to take a real quick break. I want to come back I want to touch on if we could. I don’t know I don’t know what your thoughts on the [00:39:00] the whole scandal with Christopher Wray not turning over this document. But I kind of. Because because I’ve got you. I want to ask you about it because you’re a man in the know. So let’s take a real quick break. We’ll be right back. My guest today, Frank Gaffney, author of the brand new book The Indictment Prosecuting the Chinese Communist Party and Friends for Crimes Against America, China and the World. We’ll be right back on The Steve Hook Show on TNT Radio.With his expert analysis and opinion.

BREAK: [00:39:30]

Steve Hook: [00:41:20] Welcome back to the Steve Hook Show. My guest today, Frank Gaffney. Frank, thank you so much for hanging in. It looks to me as if, especially after hearing you talk about basically the wholesale of our sovereignty to who and also to the UN that all of a sudden starts to the puzzle pieces start to come together when you start talking about ESG and D and D and CRT and all of this social crap that’s coming down on us. Is that all part of the same puzzle, Frank, before we get to the FBI.

Frank Gaffney: [00:41:59] 100%. [00:42:00] Steve what we’re talking about is the full Marxist playbook and whether it’s being promoted and insinuated by the Chinese Communist Party here through techniques like TikTok, for example, or through the Confucius Institutes and their other ties into academia or Hollywood or the media or business, let alone the political elites. Those are the fruits of this so-called elite capture by them. But on the domestic side, you have, of course, a whole cadre of Marxists, many of them Maoists, who now run institutions like our educational system, for example, and some of these others that I’ve mentioned, the the the broadcast media and, you know, the culture in Hollywood, not [00:43:00] least these are the sorts of things that promote this idea that America is a racist, systemically racist country, that capitalism is a vile and oppressive form of, you know, economic activity. And communism is much to be preferred or socialism. This is the takedown of America in progress and brought to you. Yes. By enemies, foreign and domestic, who happened to be ideological soulmates and have a similar belief that only when we’re gone will the world be a better place. And, you know, to say one that they will profit from.

Steve Hook: [00:43:46] Yeah, Yeah. And of course, they’ll never live by the same standards of trying to put on us. I mean, I doubt that there’s an Lgbtq+, a Z organization in China that gets a lot of government attention. Well, it may get attention, [00:44:00] but not in the way that that that we’re giving it here. Um, that’s exactly right. Okay. So and you know what, Frank? It also when you say this, it sounds to me also and correct me if I’m wrong, but it sounds like there’s a whole bunch of useful idiots. They may not even know what they’re doing by promoting this crap like Hollywood types. You mentioned maybe some of the powerbrokers in these studios may know, but I would wager that your your standard berate star or starlet has no clue that they’re actually the puppet of of the CCP when in fact they are.

Frank Gaffney: [00:44:32] Yeah, that’s a wonderful term and it’s credited to Lennon. I’m not sure whether he actually came up with it first, but there are a lot of people who are witless and they’re exploited shamelessly. The trouble is that when you have this kind of concerted discipline, patient, long running effort to suborn people, usually with pay, sometimes it’s, you know, sexual entrapment, [00:45:00] sometimes it’s other forms of coercion or. Yeah. Or influence ideological influence. But mostly I think it’s the money in our country, how far down it goes, whether it’s B-level or whether it’s below, I don’t know. But it doesn’t really matter. What matters is that a sort of well, acceptable behavior in polite society is established and you deviate from it at your peril. You’ll be canceled, you’ll be censored. You you know, you may get reeducation camps in due course where we’re headed if the Marxists have their way. And this is why I’m prayerful, Steve, that, you know, this book will be a corrective, especially if not only folks like your audience take it aboard, but if they also ensure that the people that they have elected to represent them take the board as well and look at those 20 [00:46:00] action steps and say, you know, we can’t persist in what we’ve been doing.

Frank Gaffney: [00:46:05] We can’t pretend it’s not a problem. We can’t be appeasing it or accommodating it in any way. We have to be resisting it only through doing so, among other things, you know, getting ourselves on a war footing like the Chinese have done and removing from positions of leadership people in the elites, whether it’s in the private sector or the public sector, who are currently our leaders. I mean, for heaven’s sakes, just take this one thought aboard if, God forbid, we find ourselves in the near future, possibly in a shooting war with the Chinese Communist Party, do you think we can possibly have a guy who has been working for them, who is at best compromised at worst, is captured by them, is a controlled asset? According to my colleague Sam Faddis, a career intelligence officer [00:47:00] of the Chinese Communist Party, as the commander in chief of the United States military.

Steve Hook: [00:47:06] Well, it’s it’s certainly it’s not lost on me that this stuff really, really has ramped up in the last two and a half years since Biden took office. I mean, you’d have to be blind not to see it. And speaking about our elite leaders and some of these enemies from within, that’s a perfect segue into what’s going on with the FBI and for that matter, the White House and the Oval, not releasing a report that many the whistleblowers in the FBI say do exist, which proves conclusively that Joe Biden is very much in cahoots with his son, Hunter, and they have been getting payoffs. Now, I saw on the news this morning they were talking about it and the word is that today’s the day. Christopher Wray better turn it over, although I think he does have a meeting tomorrow with Speaker McCarthy, among others. And they want this they [00:48:00] want this document that’s apparently not classified. And Christopher Wray has been resisting at all costs to turn this over. I suspect it’s because a lot of heads could roll and a lot of major bombshells would be, well, the media would be forced to cover them. What do you think about all of that? Because Christopher Wray seems to be really treading very close to insubordination. I mean, he’s not giving anything to the oversight. Then Congress. What do you think about all of it?

Frank Gaffney: [00:48:30] To put a fine point on it, it’s a contempt of Congress. It’s not just, you know, not being polite. It he is being absolutely intransigent. And, you know, again, coming against the backdrop, particularly of all of the stuff that was in John Durham’s report about the extent to which the FBI has been absolutely malfeasant. It has been operating outside of the law. It has been engaged [00:49:00] in politics. It has chosen favors. It has favorites. It has subverted not only a presidential candidate, but the president of the United States. And Christopher Wray is up to his eyeballs in all of this. And I believe that, you know, his removal from office is another example of the kinds of captured elites that I’m talking about that has to happen. If there’s any hope that we’ll get back to the rule of law and the idea that this unclassified document. 1023 they’re calling it the form that a whistleblower alerted the the Congress to its existence is is being withheld. And continues, as best I can tell, to be withheld is just grounds for, if not the forced resignation, certainly the impeachment of Christopher Wray as the FBI director. [00:50:00]

Steve Hook: [00:50:00] And that kind of goes and that that directly goes because I mean, let’s just say hypothetically, Frank, that today Christopher Wray says, you know what, On second thought, we’ve classified it. Now you’re not getting it, which I could see happening. If that happens, there’s no out for us, is there? The only out would be the 2024 elections, the retaking of the Senate and of course, the Oval, the White House. And then and only then. I mean, is that how bad it’s gotten? That in other words, is he going to be able to hold out against Colmer? Because I mean, Colmer and the House, they’ve got a lot of power here, but even that’s being subverted, it seems. What do you suspect?

Frank Gaffney: [00:50:41] Well, I think the Congress is now putting the hammer down. They’re not going to give the FBI, I believe, another headquarters building, one that is said to be twice the size of the Pentagon. This this hurts them where [00:51:00] they live. I think that the idea that there will be withholding of funds, there will be punishment meted out at the very least in terms of restricting the FBI has the the wherewithal to do is is going to force the hand of Christopher Wray and and his colleagues. There needs to be a wholesale, you know, clearing out of those who have been complicit in one or the other of these illegal activities in the FBI. This is, after all, the premier law enforcement arm of the United States government, for heaven’s sakes. But, you know.

Steve Hook: [00:51:42] It’s also not just the FBI. It’s the CIA. You’ve got and the DNI. You had Clapper, you got John Brennan involved here. Hell, Leon Panetta signed that, that that 51, the spooks that said, oh, this looks like classic Russian disinformation. It seems like our our the [00:52:00] seventh floor of the FBI and perhaps other agencies located around Quantico and our intelligence agencies are just it’s metastasized cancer. It’s rotten to the core. That’s going to take years to figure that all out. Now.

Frank Gaffney: [00:52:15] Well, it may not take that long to clean house. It may take a little longer to put back together the kind of capabilities that we need. Look, we live in a very dangerous world. We do have both hostile foreign enemies and we have certainly domestic enemies as well. We need people who understand those truths and are capable of defending us against them as they must. But it’s not the current crop and it’s not the current organizations, unfortunately. So there’s going to have to be something of a do over. I pray that this Republican Congress will get it started and get it started right quick. They’re they’re a little slow to the mark, to my way of thinking at the moment, [00:53:00] and especially if they indulge any further in the obstructionism and, you know, other skullduggery of Christopher Wray, then, you know, they’re going to miss the window to do something that is desperately needed by our country. And more to the point, they’re emboldening our enemies. This is the key takeaway I really think of this book is the kind of contempt that the Chinese communists have for us being governed by one of their controlled assets and having so many of our leaders in the financial sector, other business leaders, as I said, Hollywood, the media, academia and political affairs working for them and we are doing nothing about it, can only reinforce Xi Jinping, the dictator of China’s conviction that he can have his way with us. I’m afraid we must disabuse them of that urgently.

Steve Hook: [00:53:58] Yeah, and that means it’s [00:54:00] going to take a stiff backbone. I must say that I’m pleasantly surprised with the job that Speaker McCarthy has done thus far, but it’s going to take a lot more, it sounds like, is what you’re saying, Frank, And it’s going to take a lot of people. I mean, I’m sure that you bend these guys ears all the time. Don’t Are you sounding the alarm? Surely you’re not the only one.

Frank Gaffney: [00:54:19] I’m doing my level best. That’s why this book is out and I’m gratified that it’s a bestseller now on Amazon. And I think that’s because the American people know something’s wrong. They may not understand it in all of its detail, but they know we need different course correction and that’s what we’re hoping to accomplish.

Steve Hook: [00:54:38] Well, listen, God bless you, Frank Gaffney. Thank you for everything you do. Thank you for getting the word out. Folks, the book is–and it’s a good one–“The Indictment.” It’s “The Indictment: Prosecuting the Chinese Communist Party and Friends for Crimes against America, China and the World.” Frank Gaffney will have you back again, I hope. God bless. Thank you, sir. Look forward. Take care. Thank you. All right. Coming [00:55:00] up on TNT radio, it’s the Patrick Henningsen Show. Until tomorrow. I’m Steve Hook on TNT Radio. Goodbye.